Debating Homophobes: Avoiding Common Pitfalls

 

The Holy Spirit distinctly and expressly declares

that in latter times

some will turn away from the faith,

giving attention to deluding and seducing spirits

and doctrines that demons teach,

Through the hypocrisy and pretensions of liars

whose consciences are seared (cauterized),
 

Who forbid people to marry

(1 Timothy 4:1-3)

While I realize many people do not believe in God, and do not believe the Scriptures are true, I believe the Bible has much more to say about same sex marriage than we have been led to believe by many in the public square, and that knowing what it says--even if one does not necessarily believe it--can go a long way toward bringing religious homophobia to an end all over the world.

When we take an intellectually honest look at the same sex marriage debate right now, I think we find that at no point in human history have we ever seen every element listed in this prophecy being fulfilled in such precise and accurate detail.  Let's break it down:

1 But the [Holy] Spirit distinctly and expressly declares that in latter times...

"In latter times" would be after the Apostle Paul wrote this, so we are nearer now to the latter times (not to be confused with the end times) than when Paul was alive, so this prophecy cannot apply to any situation he was addressing in his day.

...some will turn away from the faith...

Only Christians can "turn away from the Christian faith."  How many Christians do we see who forbid LGBT people to marry, and act in such an un-Christlike manner when doing so?...even as they refuse to even discuss Apostle Paul's ordination of same sex marriage in 1 Corinthians 7:8-9.

...giving attention to deluding and seducing spirits and doctrines that demons teach...

As discussed in Chapter 4: Messengers of the King, I believe the doctrine of forbidding LGBT people to marry is indeed demonically inspired in an effort to prevent the fulfillment of Isaiah 56, Romans 11:25, and Luke 17:34, in an effort to prevent Jesus from returning by using His Own words against Him from Luke 24:44.

...2 Through the hypocrisy... 

How much more hypocritical can it be for people who have often been divorced or committed adultery being some of the very ones who most loudly oppose same sex marriage?

...and pretensions...

How much more pretense can there be than to hear a Christian extol the virtues of exgay therapy only to be busted cruising Grindr, or the Minneapolis airport restroom, or with a RentBoy hired to carry their luggage?

...of liars...

How many more lies will we hear about how same sex marriage will lead to the end of humanity, or pedophilia, bestiality, or men marrying their refrigerators?...or the lies we hear about the causes of homosexuality, and how LGBT people are responsible for everything from hurricanes to earthquakes? Truth be known, these folks aren't even wise enough to limit their lies to one cause of homosexuality, or one result of LGBT people getting married.

...whose consciences are seared (cauterized)...

Why is it atheists often seem to have more compassion toward LGBT people than most Christians do? How many more LGBT kids have to commit suicide before the Church realizes the damage their doctrines and lies are causing?  Where is the love of Christ that is supposed to bring human compassion to our fellow man?  How many families have been torn apart?  How many LGBT kids have been kicked out of their homes?  How many LGBT clergy have been defrocked just for being honest about who God created them to be?  We don't have to look too far in order to see the loudest opposition to same sex marriage comes from those who claim to "love the sinner," but can't even demonstrate the least level of human empathy and compassion, as if they have no conscience at all.

...3 Who forbid people to marry...

Who else is being forbid to marry in the latter times (and under every condition the Holy Spirit states here) except LGBT people?  And who else is forbidding people to marry except those who call themselves Christians, but do not at all reflect the love of Christ by which Jesus said people would know they were?

I believe the specificity and accuracy of this prophecy point to the current same sex marriage debate like a laser, and I believe even the most hardened homophobe will as well, if we can just get enough LGBT people who know to share it with them.  They may still oppose same sex marriage, but they will no longer be able to use the Bible as a reason why without portraying themselves as being demonically influenced themselves.
 

For the last 10 years, I have embarked on a journey through the Scriptures, determined to better understand the common interpretations many anti-gay people use to discriminate against LGBT people.  In doing so, I have found they are always set within the context of married men who cheated on wives with other men, and not LGBT people.   This blog is an attempt to make these distinctions clear for Christians who resort to common Bible passages to bash LGBT people, but I have come to learn that it's just as important for LGBT people to understand them better as well...perhaps more so!

During the past 10 years, I have participated in hundreds of discussions about these passages, and time and again I stumble across LGBT people whose arguments against religious homophobia are actually just as dangerous sometimes as those who mean us harm, even though we are all on the same side.

For instance, I often see LGBT people say things like "Your Bible says gay people should be put to death, and that's why I reject God and your religion!"  But if we stop to think about that, what we see is these LGBT people are actually promulgating the lies the anti-gay bigots have been telling us all along.  These LGBT people have inadvertently agreed that the Bible in fact does say gay people should be put to death...even though the Bible never says any such thing.  Instead, it speaks only of men married to women who cheat on their wives with men, as illustrated in Chapter 16:  Leviticus, of The Bed Keeper.

I have often seen anti-gay bigots say "Leviticus tells us a man shall not lie with a man as with a woman, because it's an abomination!"  And I have seen many LGBT people respond by saying something like, "Well, Leviticus also says you shouldn't eat shell fish, or wear mixed fabrics!"  Again, if we really stop to think about that, the LGBT people are once again agreeing that Leviticus is addressing LGBT people, when in fact it's addressing men married to women who engage in adultery with other men, and not LGBT people.

I recall watching a famous episode of The West Wing when President Bartlett does pretty much the same thing when addressing a talk show "doctor."  In the episode, President Bartlett rattles off a long list of things from Leviticus that of course nobody actually adheres to nowadays, and we see the doctor frozen in disbelief at the absurdity of her own arguments.  But in real life, that's not the same way anti-gay bigots react.  Instead, they remind us that in the New Testament, many of the Levitical guidelines are suspended, overruled or otherwise dispensed with, but that there are still passages in the New Testament that continue to say "homosexuality is a sin."

In real life, we don't get to write the script for anti-gay bigots.  We don't get to direct them to recognize the absurdity of their misapplication of Scriptures like the producers of The West Wing got to do.  But that doesn't mean there aren't ways we can indeed illicit the same response....we simply have to do so in a smarter way.

In the New Testament, we find "homosexuality" indeed continues to be condemned, but we also see it continues to be confined to a very narrow context and audience.  As illustrated in Chapter 18: Romans, of The Bed Keeper, the context is men who are married to women who commit adultery in order to have sex with other men, in order to worship ancient Roman mythological gods.  This violates two of the Ten Commandments: "Thou shall not commit adultery," and "Thou shall have no other gods before Me."  Most Christians obviously miss this context, but once it's pointed out to them, just as the talk show radio doctor from The West Wing, they begin to recognize the error of their understanding....although most never admit it.  They simply shuffle off and go away as if they never heard you explain it to them....but that's okay!  They can't unlearn something they just learned, and as long as that is true, there is hope that one day they will come to at least stop using Romans 1 as a proof text against all gay people.

Finally, I have found that many Christians and LGBT people alike will say simply "homosexuality is a sin" or "homosexuality is not a sin."  Once again, I think it's important to consider there are different forms of homosexual expressions.  Heterosexual men rape other heterosexual men in prison all the time.  It's homosexuality.  It is sinful by anyone's definition of sin.  But it doesn't involve any LGBT people.  Another example are pedophile priests who rape boys in their own congregations as a means to avoid pregnancy.  Once again, it's homosexuality.  Once again, it's sinful by anyone's definition.  But once again, it doesn't involve LGBT people.  Saying "homosexuality is a sin" is like saying "heterosexuality is a sin."  Indeed there are many forms of heterosexuality that are sinful, such as adultery, rape, incest, etc.  But that doesn't mean all heterosexuals are sinful just because they identify as heterosexual.

In closing, I just want to encourage anyone who engages in debate with religious homophobes to be very specific in your discussions.  I hope to have illustrated how many common arguments from LGBT people actually only serve to reinforce anti-gay beliefs in regards to the Scriptures.  And I hope to have illustrated why it's important to distinguish "being gay" from "homosexuality."

Doing so allows those who adhere to Scriptures to continue to believe "homosexuality is a sin" (at least within the very narrow context delineated by Scripture), while also recognizing that "being gay" doesn't necessarily mean a person is sinful, simply by virtue of identifying as homosexual.  I cover these differences using the account of the woman caught in the act of adultery in Chapter 19:  Go, And Sin No More.

I encourage all LGBT people to keep up the good fight, and hope these insights help you sharpen your debating skills in a way that will truly leave anti-gay bigots just as slack jawed as the radio doctor from The West Wing....but we'll have to be a bit more specific than President Bartlett.

This Frequently Asked Questions quick reference guide responds to the most common anti-gay Bible based arguments that may help even further.  Not only does it refute the common passages used against LGBT people, but goes on to point out Scriptures indicating LGBT people are born so, and that same sex marriage is ordained by the Bible itself!  You can either use it to help improve your debate points, or even better, you can simply send the link to the anti-gay bigots you encounter and get back to more important things, like enjoying your life!  I hope these tips help!

GO GET 'EM TIGERS!

__________________________________

THANK YOU for your generous support of this work!

Let him who receives instruction in the Word of God share all good things with his teacher, contributing to his support.  Galatians 6:6

Tap to Donate

10% of all donations received by this ministry are tithed to my personal Home Church.

The remaining 90% are used exclusively to purchase necessary equipment, to cover fees related to funding our ministry website, to produce, advertise, publish, and distribute teaching media, books, and videos, and to fund regular operational costs incurred in the process of reaching out to Churches and Pastors to share these teachings with their Congregations.

We couldn't do it without YOU!

__________________________________

How Christians Can Save the GOP

The Holy Spirit distinctly and expressly declares

that in latter times

some will turn away from the faith,

giving attention to deluding and seducing spirits

and doctrines that demons teach,

Through the hypocrisy and pretensions of liars

whose consciences are seared (cauterized),

Who forbid people to marry

(1 Timothy 4:1-3)

As many Christians watched the election results on November 6, 2012, a sinking feeling overcame many in the GOP as reality sunk in and folks began to realize they had been hoodwinked into believing Mitt Romney was going to win. Even though I have been a lifelong Democrat, I've been a Christian even longer, (and I've been gay even longer than that). I was very proud of our country as Americans wholeheartedly rejected the unChristian lies coming from the Romney camp itself, but also from what has been dubbed the Conservative Entertainment Media Complex. I believe President Obama has more than earned his 2nd term as the leader of the free world, and I look forward to the next 4 years with an eager anticipation filled with great hopes for this administration, and the future of our great nation.

I know the election was a disappointment to many people. Every election leaves someone disappointed. But continuing to ignore the missteps of Governor Romney and the nonfactual reporting of the Right Wing Entertainment Media will only result in continuing to isolate the GOP from the mainstream of the majority of Americans...and many leaders in the GOP are beginning to say so.

As a democracy, we are governed by majority vote. As long as the GOP alienates folks who may otherwise vote for them, they will continue to lose elections. As long as the GOP refuses to establish themselves as trustworthy messengers of a path forward for our country, refuses to provide the level of transparency Americans have come to expect from our leaders, and refuses to come clean with their own personal finances, America will continue to be skittish about voting for anyone representing the GOP party...at least anyone vying for the the highest offices in the land.

But all is not lost. There are ways for the GOP to regain a majority by first coming up with superior ideas that move Americans forward, not backward. The American democratic process is based on a 2 party system. We expect both parties to present ideas to Americans for us to choose between. In this election cycle, (and the former one with McCain/Palin), the GOP failed to develop ideas that appealed to the majority of Americans. They shed vast amounts of their professionalism and credibility by pandering to the most extreme (aka "crazy") voters, with the most extreme (aka "say anything to get elected") candidates they could find to run. And they lost. Big time! This has left many individual conservative voters disappointed and disillusioned.

It's time for some truth.

The Right Wing Conservative Entertainment Media does not care about individual conservative voters. They make money based on advertising and viewers, not votes. The same goes for activist Christian pastors. While statements based in a false reality created by these two powerhouses of conservative communicators may indeed draw an audience, garner advertisers, and generate "AMENS" in Church, (and even though they may even generate a large swath of agreement amongst individual conservative voters who want to portray themselves as "team members"), these created realities are useless in a very real election where non-conservative voters become part of the electoral equation as well.

As many conservatives are beginning to see, folks like Rush Limbaugh make all kinds of money for themselves, but that doesn't necessarily create votes at the ballot box, and clearly doesn't do conservative voters any favors in terms of how they are perceived by the majority of Americans. Right Wing commentators like Ann Coulter and Sean Hannity brand conservatives (just as many Christians brand Jesus) in ways that do not reflect the reality of the vast majority of conservatives, and they do it by branding liberals in ways that do not reflect the reality of the vast majority of liberals. It gets them on TV, but in reality, it doesn't generate votes for the GOP. If anything, this election proves that it actually costs votes. These Right Wing pundits give both conservatives (and Christians) a bad name...but what do they care? They (like Karl Rove), are being paid millions of dollars, whether you ever vote Republican...or not.

While some individual conservatives may be entertained by that, (or made to feel an inflated sense of their own self importance), until they begin operating in a fact-based world, conservatives will continue to lose voters, and Churches will continue to lose members. But there are ways Christians themselves can save the GOP, and each of these ideas are actually listed in the Bible. Knowing how few Christians actually read the Bible, I thought it may be helpful to bring some of them to light for your consideration as a Conservative, as a Christian, and as a voter.

These ideas include embracing LGBT people and affirming us as full participants in the spiritual life of the Christian Church per God's Own commands (Isaiah 55:11 - Isaiah 56:12), as described in detail in Chapter 4: Messengers of The King. This one simple step will lead to increased membership in the Christian Church. God prophesies we will bring offerings to His altar. This one simple step will lead to increased finances for the Christian Church. These two steps alone will open the door for conservatives to begin speaking into the lives of LGBT people with messages other than "you're going to hell!"

Such messages may garner "AMENS" from the pews, and help pastors fleece the flock to fund a false (and failing) war on same sex marriage, but they do nothing to increase church membership or church finances, and do nothing to bring LGBT people into the Conservative flock.... instead, they have the exact opposite effect of pushing us away from both conservatism and Christianity....and our money (and votes) along with us, as illustrated in Chapter 20: Fire From Heaven. And it doesn't stop there!

Isaiah 56:8 must come to pass in order for Romans 11:25 to come to pass. This simple step means LGBT people begin to more keenly recognize our own vested interest in a more robust relationship between the United States and Israel...and Gaza. It defines a prophetic role of LGBT people to prepare the Church for the 2nd Coming of Jesus (Luke 24:44), and opens the door for the entire Christian Church to begin preparing Jews for the arrival of the 1st Messiah they will recognize (which are one and the same events), described in detail in Chapter 22: Jesus, Jews, and Gays.

In light of the recent military skirmishes between Gaza and Israel, we even find a remedy from God's Word which involves LGBT people becoming ministers of peace among all 3 Abrahamic religions (and every other religion), as explored in Chapter 21: Gaza: Holy Land for Gays.

There's much more to share in this regard, and I have discussed some of them at length in other chapters of The Bed Keeper. Often times, these ideas are rejected out of hand because Christians have never heard of most of them, even though each and every one is demonstrably illustrated by God in the Bible, whether the Church--or those politically motivated activist Christian pastors--ever say so, or not. This wouldn't be the first time the Church was wrong about something.

So perhaps it is time to revisit some of those ideas, and perhaps it's time for Christians to set aside their preconceived notions about LGBT people, and open their eyes to see us as God sees us: as naturally born members of God's Created Order, destined to fulfill various prophecies issued by God Himself, with a goal of preparing the world for the return of Jesus....with the side benefit of increasing membership and funding for both conservatism and Christianity....which will inevitably translate into more GOP votes.

While it may take years for LGBT people (and Americans in general) to ever trust the GOP again, we are a forgiving people. We all want to see the GOP get its act together, and once again begin providing Americans with viable plans for the future to go head to head with the Democrats' ideas. Most LGBT people I know feel confined to vote Democrat because the GOP has seemingly rejected us (and our votes) with their opposition to same sex marriage even though the Apostle Paul himself ordained it, as Chapter 2: God Sanctioned Gay Marriage illustrates.

We have felt condemned by the Church simply for being born as LGBT people, even though Jesus Himself taught we are born naturally in order to fulfill a vital prophetic role in His return, as Chapter 1: Born This Way clearly demonstrates.

Christians have traditionally misapplied passages from Scripture that were actually addressing heterosexual men married to women who engaged in adultery with other men--and not LGBT people--as illustrated in Chapter 16: Leviticus, Chapter 18: Romans, and Chapter 19: Go, and Sin No More.  Instead, God's Word demonstrates that there is but one proper way to begin speaking to LGBT people about Jesus, as revealed through the account of the Ethiopian Eunuch in Chapter 3: For the Kingdom of Heaven.

And Christians have traditionally misapplied passages from Scripture that were actually addressing God's purge of fallen angels--and not LGBT people--in the account of Sodom's destruction, as demonstrated in Chapter 14: Men of Sodom.

Maybe the best thing Christians can do to save the GOP is read the Bible, and recognize that God has reserved a place for LGBT people at His Table, in His Kingdom, and in His Church--as well as in the prophetic role of Jesus' return--even if the Church chooses to ignore it. After all, until these things come to pass, Jesus cannot return (Luke 24:44), and until Jesus does return, nobody gets resurrected to the eternal life He died to give us. (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17).  So reading the Bible in this case wouldn't simply be a homework assignment....your own personal resurrection depends upon it, whether you know it now or not.

Maybe the best thing Christians can do to save the GOP is invite your own LGBT family members to church, and begin to recognize (and treat them) as members of God's family too, because we are, whether you know it now or not.

Maybe the best thing Christians can do is to confront some of those activist Christian preachers that recommend you beat your gay kids, or recommend supporting government sponsored genocide of LGBT people, and replace them with a pastor who actually preaches the Bible, and not just what you have always been told the Bible says about LGBT people.

And maybe the best thing Christians can do is stop getting all their news from the Right Wing Entertainment Complex. Check out several sources, both liberal and conservative. It doesn't take long to find the Fox in the hen house!

And maybe....just maybe.....the GOP can pull this one out of the crapper....

...but that's up to you guys.


PS: I know many Christians' first repsonse to this will be: "Well, that's just impossible! Homosexuality is an abomination to God!" (or something along those lines). If that's you, it may be helpful to begin by reviewing the Frequently Asked Questions reference guide.

__________________________________

THANK YOU for your generous support of this work!

Let him who receives instruction in the Word of God share all good things with his teacher, contributing to his support.  Galatians 6:6

Tap to Donate

10% of all donations received by this ministry are tithed to my personal Home Church.

The remaining 90% are used exclusively to purchase necessary equipment, to cover fees related to funding our ministry website, to produce, advertise, publish, and distribute teaching media, books, and videos, and to fund regular operational costs incurred in the process of reaching out to Churches and Pastors to share these teachings with their Congregations.

We couldn't do it without YOU!

__________________________________

Why Not Polygamy?

The Holy Spirit distinctly and expressly declares

that in latter times

some will turn away from the faith,

giving attention to deluding and seducing spirits

and doctrines that demons teach,

Through the hypocrisy and pretensions of liars

whose consciences are seared (cauterized),

Who forbid people to marry

(1 Timothy 4:1-3)

During the video debate between Brian Brown, President of the National Organization for Marriage, and Dan Savage, writer of the Savage Love column, met at Savage's home in Seattle for dinner and a debate over same sex marriage and the Bible, and the question of polygamy came up.

The question of polygamy has been one that so far the LGBT community and other same sex marriage advocates have been unable to address in a way that eliminates the expressed fears of same sex marriage leading to polygamy.  The reasoning our opponents often use is that since our argument for same sex marriage is based on non-discrimination and marriage equality, then what would prevent polygamists (even heterosexual ones) from arguing for polygamy on the same basis?  ... and how is it not hypocritical of marriage equality advocates for opposing polygamy?

In the main, the response from marriage equality advocates has been something along the lines of "well, the gay community is not seeking to enter into plural single gender marriages," and "we don't know of any polygamists who are advocating for polygamy on the same basis, and if there are any, they should be the ones who make that case in the public square."

Unfortunately, these do not address the real world example Brian Brown refers to in Canada, where heterosexual polygamists (largely of the Muslim and Mormon faiths) have indeed approached the courts for an answer regarding the apparent hypocrisy on the part of marriage equality advocates who support  (2 spouse only) same sex marriages, but not plural spouse marriages.  The concern expressed by Brian Brown's question during the debate is that the same thing could happen in America (and other countries) when same sex marriage becomes law of the land.

I hope to illustrate some distinctions that so far seem to have not yet found a voice in the public square.

While Brian makes the point that if its discrimination to deny same sex couples full legal recognition, then why is it not also discriminatory to deny polygamous marriages, whether heterosexual or homosexual?

The question poses ways to frame the debate in a way I think most advocates of single gender marriage miss, and that is that all things considered, I think Brian is right; discriminating against polygamy is the same as discriminating against same sex marriage...except for two important distinctions:

1). The Morrill Anti-Bigamy Act of 1862, signed by President Lincoln, bans marriage to more than one spouse at a time. This provides legal precedence for denying polygamous marriage recognition by the state, but cannot alone justify discrimination against same sex marriage on the same basis, because it deals with a totally different issue: plural spouses.  But there is nothing that says this law can't be deemed unconstitutional in the future if single gender marriages are legally recognized, except for:

2). Polygamy by its very nature (whether heterosexual or homosexual) presents a compelling state interest to ban them, because it impedes the state's ability to perform its fiduciary duty to regulate divorce, division of marital property, and child custody and/or alimony, palimony and/or child support payments when one of the spouses divorces the rest of the spouses.

I think it's important to remember that same sex marriage is not about "granting" a right to be obtained by our Constitution. It is a right to be "identified" and "secured," and it is a right that must not be denied without a compelling state interest.   The Prop 8 trial underscores this point really well; it's not so much a matter of same sex marriage being a Constitutional right, but more so, the question courts must answer is whether or not the state has any compelling reason for denying them.

As the overall marriage debate has been explored, I think it's clear that there is a compelling state interest in denying legal recognition of polygamous marriages, but no such compelling state interest exists that justifies the state denying legal recognition of same sex marriages. 

Most marriage equality advocates respond by saying something along the lines of "traditionally speaking, polygamous marriage in the context of the Bible were comprised of one man and multiple women" or "I don't know of any example of polygamy that's been one woman and multiple men, or multiple same sex partners."

But with Brian's question, he specifically asked "what about 3 women" or "what about 3 men?"   While polygamy has historically been between one man and multiple women, so too has monogamous marriage been traditionally heterosexual in nature.

What I think Brian Brown gets at is the converse of the point he makes: arguing against polygamy based on its traditionally defined nature is the same as arguing against same sex marriages based on traditionally defined heterosexual marriages.  In other words, Brian was implying that if we are going to discriminate against polygamy based on "it's just wrong," then he should be free to discriminate against same sex marriage based on "it's just wrong" as well.

That's why I think it's a stronger argument to make the distinctions based on the state's responsibility for regulating what happens when either marriage paradigm doesn't work out (i.e. divorce, child custody, palimony payments, division of marital assets, etc.)

Either way, Dan didn't take the bait, and brought up a great observation in that polygamy also denies equality to (even opposite gender couples), by presenting an impediment to men having an equal shot at heterosexual marriage as the few men who can afford to support multiple wives.

But as we can see this has clearly been a concern since same sex marriage first came up for discussion in the public square, and I think it's important for marriage equality advocates to be prepared with a stronger basis that can assure concerned parties that same sex marriage will not lead to polygamous marriages, as well as why.   Doing so frames the debate not based on "I'm gay and have a Constitutional right to marry a man," but rather,

"I'm gay, and the Constitution bars anyone from preventing me to marry one, non-related, consenting adult of my choice, regardless of their gender identity."

Of course this brings us to why marriage equality opponents oppose polygamy, which in America is deeply rooted in the Mormon church's ability to outpace the growth of other Christian denominations vis-a-vis accelerated rates of procreation that polygamous marriages lend themselves to. 

While I absolutely agree that the polygamy argument (as well as all other arguments from our opponents) have proven to be red herrings, to those who share the concern, I believe it still needs to be addressed in a way that shows the concern is unwarranted. Just declaring it to be a red herring doesn't really do that, I don't think.

I believe that leaving the question of polygamy unanswered (whether gay or straight) means it isn't going away, as evidenced by the fact it has been presented as a concern by our opponents since the early public discourse on marriage equality first began. 

Just because we or they may not know of anyone who is currently seeking multiple spouse same sex marriages, doesn't demonstrate how polygamy should be discriminated against because of the compelling state interests articulated earlier, while at the same time demonstrating why same sex marriage should not be prohibited on the same basis.

While I understand it can be frustrating to even have to dignify the point with a response, if we want to overcome the objection successfully, I believe we must do more than just point out how remote the possibility seems to us currently and personally, by demonstrating how and why the law already prevents polygamy, (whether same sex marriage becomes law of the land or not), and how marriage equality for same sex marriages will not lead to (even heterosexual) polygamous marriages...

...and more importantly, why we think it is *not* hypocritical for same sex marriageadvocates to continue to oppose polygamy, even while advocating under the banner of "marriage equality."

Again, the polygamy comparison is an original debate point that has not been adequately addressed by our side to the point that folks like Dan Savage are able to rattle it off the top of his head.  I think developing a sound response drives one more nail in the coffin of the bigotry that stands against us, and again, I believe it frames the debate to answer the questions the courts are actually going to ask:

Is there a compelling government interest in prohibiting polygamy?

Clearly, the answer is yes.

Does that same compelling government interest then also justify prohibiting same sex marriage?

Clearly the answer is no.

The example Brian Brown gave pertaining to heterosexuals in Canada seeking to grant legal recognition to polygamous heterosexual marriages is in fact true. (Largely the argument in Canada stems from religious based plural marriages pertaining to people of the Muslim and Mormon faiths who believe in heterosexual polygamy. They argue that since Canada recognizes same sex marriage based on non-discrimination, that they must also recognize polygamous heterosexual marriages on the same basis).

Our opponents fear the same can happen in America, not only in regards to Muslims, but the Mormons as well....and not necessarily in the context of single gender polygamous marriages, but even heterosexual ones.

My point is we can't make events in Canada untrue -- (nor can we allay fears of the same events transpiring in America) -- just by saying that we don't know of any LGBT people seeking single gender polygamous marriages, and that we do know of LGBT people seeking single gender monogamous marriages.   I believe the legal considerations I articulated are a step toward that goal, and I hope other equally strong arguments emerge as well.

While asking some hypothetical "what will gays marrying lead to?" does nothing constructive to real life same sex couples who are in need of the state and federal benefits of marriage that most heterosexuals take for granted, I believe all will agree that upon further consideration, answering the question does!

...and we need all the help we can get!

Related Articles:

God Sanctioned Gay Marriage Which explores a variety of Scriptures that appear to demonstrate that the Apostle Paul ordained single gender holy matrimony for people whom Jesus exempted from heterosexual marriage in 1 Corinthians 7:8-9, (even while addressing one of the famous clobber passages from 1 Corinthians 6:9-10), and the implications it would have on the Christian Church if true.

Born This Way  Which explores Scriptures that the Church has been reluctant to talk about, and even less enthusiastic to teach. It demonstrates Jesus taught LGBTQIQ people are born so from our mothers' wombs to fulfill a prophetically vital purpose not only in the spiritual life of the Christian Church, but also in the return of Jesus Christ.

After Gay Marriage Which illustrates why especially the Church, but also many anti-gay organizations truly fear same sex marriage becoming law of the land.

Frequently Asked Questions Which re-examines the most common traditional Christian teachings regarding the Scriptures pertaining to same gender sexual expresions.

Questions and comments can be emailed to TheBedKeeper@gmail.com

Thanks for taking the time!

08.31.12 EDIT TO ADD:

I received this in response to the blog, with permission from the author to include here.  It provides a detailed examination of polgyamy vs. single gender marriage in Canada, where same sex marriages are legal, and polygamy remains illegal, and why:

I'm surprised that Americans don't seem to realize that Canada has already ruled that polygamy is illegal. The question arose because of Muslim immigrants who wanted to marry more than one wife, and the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints of Bountiful, British Columbia. The argument of both these groups was that Section 2 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms grants freedom of religion, and that their religion happens to embrace polygamy. They ignored the fact that the Supreme Court of Canada had already ruled on several occasions that religious rights cannot trump Canadian law.

In 2011, thirteen groups, both pro and con polygamy, presented Briefs to Chief Justice Robert Bauman of BC Supreme Court, who was asked by the government to rule on whether or not S. 293 CC, proscribing polygamy, was constitutional. The judge took four months to study the Briefs, then brought down his decision on November 23, 2011. He ruled that, based on all the evidence, polygamy harmed ALL society in that it contravened women's equality rights and impoverished their children, and because Nature has made the sexes almost equal in number (there aren't even two women for every one man), should rich males collect many women as concubines, it would rob poorer men of the chance to have a wife and family of their own, which would result in severe social disorder. His decision was greeted with great relief by mainstream Canadians, particularly mainstream women who saw the attempt to legalize polygamy as an attempt to reduce their status to second-class citizenship.

Polygamy comes from the cruel dark ages when women had no rights whatsoever and were treated as chattels. There is no place in the modern world for women being collected as concubines in harems. The year is 2012 AD, not 2012 BC.

Regarding same sex marriage, which is legal in Canada. Same sex marriage still involves only two people, both of whom have equal rights and equal responsibilities. This is not the case with polygamy, where one man lords it over many women, all of whom are in competition with one another for his attention to them and their children. As well, only the first, legal wife and her children are entitled to share in the man's health insurances, pensions and tax benefits. The remaining women and their children are on their own and face poverty. Judge Bauman took all this into consideration when he brought down his decision.

I hope this information is of use to you, and that you will publish it in your newsletter. Americans need to learn that polygamy in Canada is regarded as a contravention of women's equality rights. 

Sincerely,
Jancis M. Andrews

PS:   I've just realized I didn't add the name of the group I work with. It's called "Stop Polygamy in Canada," and was founded by Nancy Mereska of Two Hills, Alberta, herself an escapee from a strict Mormon marriage. I'd be grateful if you'd add the group's name to the bottom of my email to you.

The group has waged a fierce battle for many years to get the BC government to lay charges against those male elders in the polygamous cult of Bountiful (the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) who have threatened underage girls that if they didn't agree to polygamy and become "celestial wives" i.e., concubines in Bountiful's harems, their immortal souls would burn for ever in Hell. This is an evil cult where a corrupt and twisted version of the Christian religion provides middle-aged men with an excuse for a sex fest. The hearing before Chief Justice Bauman was the result of our group's work, allied with hundreds of thousands of Canadians who were outraged that the BC government would abandon very young girls to be raped and impregnated in the name of Jehovah God.

Canada does not have clean hands on this issue, but at long last our reluctant government is being forced to take action. Many of us feel that those many government officials who knew about the sexual abuse of Bountiful's girl children, but who did nothing to stop it, are as criminal as the criminals themselves, and should be jailed along with them. Unfortunately, that won't happen, since Canadians are not allowed to sue the attorney-general, neither for what he has done, nor for what he has NOT done. How's that for democracy? 


My heartfelt thanks goes to Jancis for the info!

__________________________________

THANK YOU for your generous support of this work!

Let him who receives instruction in the Word of God share all good things with his teacher, contributing to his support.  Galatians 6:6

Tap to Donate

10% of all donations received by this ministry are tithed to my personal Home Church.

The remaining 90% are used exclusively to purchase necessary equipment, to cover fees related to funding our ministry website, to produce, advertise, publish, and distribute teaching media, books, and videos, and to fund regular operational costs incurred in the process of reaching out to Churches and Pastors to share these teachings with their Congregations.

We couldn't do it without YOU!

__________________________________

After Gay Marriage

The Holy Spirit distinctly and expressly declares

that in latter times

some will turn away from the faith,

giving attention to deluding and seducing spirits

and doctrines that demons teach,

Through the hypocrisy and pretensions of liars

whose consciences are seared (cauterized),

Who forbid people to marry

(1 Timothy 4:1-3)


I have this [one charge to make] against you:
that you have left (abandoned) the love that you had at first
[you have deserted Me, your first love].

Remember then from what heights you have fallen.
Repent (change the inner man to meet God’s will) and
do the works you did previously [when first you knew the Lord],
 or else I will visit you and remove your lampstand from its place,
unless you change your mind and repent.
(Revelation 2:4-5)

Dear Pastor,

Greetings in the Name of Our Lord, Jesus Christ!

If you've been keeping up with The Bed Keeper, you know that the Biblical truths shared therein prove that Jesus taught we're born gay in Matthew 19:12, that the Apostle Paul ordained single gender holy matrimony in 1 Corinthians 7:8-9, that the Holy Spirit warned that Christians would fall away from the faith and forbid people to marry in 1 Timothy 4:1-3, that God demands full affirmation of LGBT people in the spiritual life of the Christian Church in Isaiah 55:11-56:12, that Paul taught that Isaiah 56:8 must come to pass before Jews are reinstated into covenant with God under the New Covenant in Romans 11:25, and that Jesus taught that He cannot return until all these things have first come to pass in Luke 24:44.

While I recognize most Pastors feel confined to preach only what's been on the cue cards for the past 2,000 years in regards to these things, I also recognize something you may have not considered: what happens after gay marriage becomes law of the land. 

Let's not kid ourselves, Pastor:
We both know it's not a matter of "if" but of "when."

 

I also recognize that many Pastors receive their largest church funding from politically motivated individuals who are basically paying you to advertise against gay marriage for them.  You are convinced this is "God's Way" and are reluctant to share the truths that are revealed from Scripture as detailed in The Bed Keeper with these large donors, because you know as soon as you do they'll stop contributing to you, or worse yet, run you out of the pastorate altogether.  We know how these things work behind the scenes of Sunday morning sermons.

But something you may not recognize is that once gay marriage is the law of the land (and your advertising services are no longer needed), these same large donors will immediately cease to fund your church for said purposes.  Aside from abortion, there really are no voter animating social issues for which to pay you to promote for them.  Christian opposition to adultery, divorce, drinking, slavery, women's rights, and anti-Semitism have all been tossed upon the dustbin of history when it comes to motivating Christians to vote one way or the other.  We both know that if you hammer as hard on any of these issues as you are paid to hammer on gay rights, you would be run out of town on a rail just as quickly as if you stopped preaching against "teh gay."

So what are you going to do once gay marriage becomes law of the land?  How will your church survive?  What will you do for a living?  Who will pay your salary? 

Well, fortunately, God has a plan!  It's revealed most clearly in The Bed Keeper in Chapter 20:  Fire From Heaven.  I hope you have already read it, and I encourage you to re-read it even if you have already.  But there's a catch:  It depends on you!  And it's going to require some courage and a decision on your part.

I think I speak for the entire gay community when I share with you that changing your tune after gay marriage is law of the land, (in hopes of attracting gay people to your congregation as you suddenly "evolve" on the issue as you see the last shreds of political money dry up) just simply isn't good enough.  No, you're going to have to have already made that decision before gay marriage becomes the law of the land.  (Otherwise, how else will we know that you aren't just trying to appear gay affirming just for our money?)

You're going to have to build some trust before that.  You're going to have to be on board and ready to hit the ground running to roll this message out to your congregation *prior* to gay marriage becoming law of the land.  And you're going to have to make your decision publicly known at least loudly enough that the gay community can hear you, or you're going to have to face financial bankruptcy.  There really are no other choices, because those churches who stand with the LGBT community prior to gay marriage becoming the law of the land will be the ones we continue to gradually embrace, and advertise, and recommend to our friends and family afterwards. 

Oh sure, there will be some churches that remain unaffected after gay marriage becomes the law of the land, even if their large anti gay donors pull their funding....at least at first.  But they too will slowly (or not so slowly) dry up as strife and division caused by old underlying issues re-emerge as the issue of the day, and are no longer kicked down the road by changing the subject to gay marriage.  You may not see it yet.  But that doesn't mean you can't imagine it.

This letter is not a "demand" that you respond or make your position known.  It is an invitation for you to begin meeting with your boards to "talk turkey" and decide amongst yourselves how your church will respond when your large donors pull out.  On one hand, it will come as a sigh of relief to many of your board members to have such folks out of your hair.  On the other hand, if you have not made plans to usher in God's plan for LGBT people being affirmed in your church, you're going to have to go through some financially dry months, or years, or how ever long it is you think you can survive without your large donors until your church does affirm LGBT people.  It's just a matter of time.

Speaking of time, I would probably word this notice with a bit more grace and less urgency, but as we quickly approach the inevitable, I find that I don't have quite enough time for the formalities any more....and neither do you....whether you realize it or not.  While this notice may come off sounding smug, I hope you realize what a favor from God this truly is for you.  After all, part of me is so frustrated and angry at the church that I'm tempted in my flesh to just let you all disappear from the face of the earth and let us start over....but God seems to have other plans....and I admit it's much better not only for you, but for all the congregants who depend on the Church for their spiritual well being as well. 

The needs of the many clearly outweigh the needs of the few in this case.  I hope to assure you that it is not my intent to bring damage to your church, but to warn you of impending financial hardships that will see thousands of churches go bankrupt inside the first year of gay marriage becoming the law of the land, and offering a life line...just as God seemed to have planned all along.

As illustrated in Chapter 20 of The Bed Keeper, God not only requires your church to affirm LGBT people in the spiritual life of the Body of Christ, He also prophetically mandates our offerings to be brought to His altar.  He has seen this coming for a long time.  The question is, Do you?

We need to know you're on board.  I am more than willing to announce to the LGBT community when you decide to become an affirming congregation, and have demonstrated an awareness of the truths revealed in Scripture as outlined in The Bed Keeper.  But we need to establish communication now.  As you'll see, I had gone so far as to endorse my former church as a safe space for LGBT people, and then they very publicly and voluntarily decided to maintain the status quo instead...after they had already received thousands of dollars of contributions from LGBT people that I had personally recommended begin giving to them.  I won't repeat that mistake.  With the resources Lakewood Church currently enjoys, they will last whether gay folks are there or not.  But not all churches are created equal. 

As you'll also see, one other church has been endorsed by me prior to that, but they have a prophetic mandate to be so, even as they have not yet confirmed nor denied their position on LGBT people being affirmed in their church.  While in seven years of following their ministry, I have never heard an anti-gay word out of them, I have likewise never received from them what I am seeking from you.  But Eagle Mountain International Church has been clearly and uniquely chosen by God to spearhead this transition in the Body of Christ, whether they know it or not.  I know they will get there one day.  But can we say the same about your church?

Please contact me at thebedkeeper@gmail.com to let us know where you are in the process:

1.  You are just now learning of The Bed Keeper and will begin immediately studying the findings contained therein

2.  You have read The Bed Keeper and are currently sharing with your board and church leadership

3.  You have read The Bed Keeper and have decided to announce your affirmation of the LGBT community in your house of worship prior to gay marriage becoming the law of the land, and will decide whether or not to conduct same gender unions on a case by case basis

4.  You have no intention of ever doing any of the above.

The choice is yours, but we need to hear from you sooner, rather than later.  Again any church deciding to become affirming *after* gay marriage is the law of the land will be viewed as suspect, and seen as only willing to change when the laws of the land are changed, rather than staying ahead of the curve and following God wherever He leads and when.  We simply won't be able to trust the motivations of such a follower church.  We need leader churches stepping up before then, if we are to trust them.

We're ready with money in hand to close the budget shortfalls the large donors will inevitably and undoubtedly leave behind when they no longer have need of you, but we need to hear from you today! 

I appreciate your time and consideration of these matters, and I look forward to your response whether it is in agreement or to the contrary.

Sincerely,

Brian Anthony Bowen

Author, The Bed Keeper

PS:  I realize you may still have questions concerning some of the Scriptural findings discussed in The Bed Keeper.   I refer you to the Frequently Asked Questions reference guide that will get you started, and I am more than willing to discuss in further detail at the email address above.  I encourage you to read the open letters previously published to major leaders throughout Christendom, which appear in the side bar menu. 

Following is a brief description of each chapter of The Bed Keeper that may help to focus your area of interest:

Chapter 1:  Born This Way
Explores Scriptures that the Church has been reluctant to talk about, and even less enthusiastic to teach. It demonstrates Jesus taught LGBTQIQ people are born so from our mothers' wombs to fulfill a prophetically vital purpose not only in the spiritual life of the Christian Church, but also in the return of Jesus Christ.

Chapter 2:  God Sanctioned Gay Marriage
Explores a variety of Scriptures that appear to demonstrate that the Apostle Paul ordained single gender holy matrimony for people whom Jesus exempted from heterosexual marriage in 1 Corinthians 7:8-9, (even while addressing one of the famous clobber passages from 1 Corinthians 6:9-10), and the implications it would have on the Christian Church if true.

Chapter 3:  For the Kingdom of Heaven
Examines the only account of personal evangelism in all of Scripture through the baptism of the Ethiopian Eunuch, including a thorough examination of why it serves as an important evidence of the New Covenant being ratified through Jesus' earthly ministry, how it relates to the Old Covenant, and debunks the notion that LGBTQIQ people cannot also be Christians.

Chapter 4:  Messengers of The King
Explores allegorical examinations of Scripture that reveal the apparent prophetic and eschatalogical roles of LGBTQIQ Christians in preparing the Bride of Christ for the return of Jesus.

Chapter 5:  Covenant Promises
Explores the promises made available to all Christians through the New Covenant as compared to the Old Covenant, and how they apply to LGBTQIQ Believers.

Chapter 6:  Lord of The Sabbath
Explores Scripture that helps define what Keeping the Sabbath means for Christians, and the unique importance to LGBTQIQ people.

Chapter 7:  Baptized With Fire
Explores the Scriptural account of the Day of Pentecost, the spiritual empowerment that comes with the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, and the unique focus God seems to place on LGBTQIQ people receiving this heavenly gift as well.

Chapter 8:  Spiritual Leadership
Explores Scriptural definitions of being led by the Holy Spirit into a spiritually empowered and fruitful life as a Christian.

Chapter 9:  Gotta Have Faith!
Examines the Scriptural accounts of Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, as well as Ebed-Melech (the other Ethiopian Eunuch), who rescued the prophet Jeremiah from impending doom and ensured God's Word survived against all odds. Encourages LGBTQIQ people to develop the same kind of faith that landed some of these folks in the Great Hall of Faith of Hebrews 11.

Chapter 10:  No Dry Trees!
Explores Scriptural truths illustrating God's command to "be fruitful and multiply" does not always mean having biological children.

Chapter 11:  Big Bang Theory
Especially for our atheist, agnostic, and antitheist LGBTQIQ Brothers and Sisters, embark on a journey through time and space and discover how God seems to have used evolution in order to create. Includes a scientific time stamp that shows it took a bit longer than six 24-hour days for God to create the universe.

Chapter 12:  My Brother's Keeper
Explores the spiritual import of the early chapters of Genesis examining the first Messianic prophecy, the origins of animal sacrifice under the Old Covenant, and reveals that perhaps Cain didn't marry his sister after all.

Chapter 13:  The Rainbow Covenant
Long before the rainbow was a symbol of dignity, diversity and destiny for the LGBTQIQ community, it was also an early symbol of God's promises and covenant with mankind.

Chapter 14:  Men of Sodom
Re-examines long held traditional understandings of the destruction of Sodom, and reveals that not only were the men of Sodom *not* homosexual...they weren't even human.

Chapter 15:  Entertaining Angels
Building off conclusions reached in Chapter 14: Men of Sodom, explores additional details of the great rebellion of Satan and his angels against God, and even reveals their individual names.

Chapter 16:  Leviticus
Explores another famous clobber passage in forensic detail, revealing that Scripture does not even speak of LGBTQIQ people in Leviticus, but of opposite gender married men who were having their cake and eating it too.

Chapter 17:  Forbid To Marry
A unique examination of the words arsenokoitai and malakoi and their relevance to the 1 Timothy 1:10 clobber passage, revealing them to define early "gay-for-pay" cult temple prostitution, and not LGBTQIQ people.

Chapter 18:  Romans
Long held assumptions about Romans 1 in regards to LGBTQIQ people are debunked, while illustrating the idolatry and adultery being engaged in by opposite gender married people, which many Christians seem to ignore even though it violates 2 of the 10 Commandments.

Chapter 19:  Go, And Sin No More
Examines the differences between "being gay" and "homosexuality" in light of the woman who was accused of adultery, and why Jesus said, "let him without sin cast the first stone." We see that just as many Christians do today, Scripture was selectively applied by the Pharisees of Jesus' Day to condemn the innocent, while protecting the guilty.

Chapter 20:  Fire From Heaven
Explores the importance of LGBTQIQ people in regards to our full affirmation and inclusion in the spiritual life of the Church as full and equal participants in the prophetic destiny of Christ's return.

Chapter 21:  GAZA:  Holy Land for Gays
Explores the apparent role of LGBTQIQ Christians as ministers of the Gospel to LGBTQIQ people of other religions and nations, as religious dividing walls are abolished and all faiths come together as one.

Chapter 22:  Jesus, Jews and Gays
Explores the role of LGBTQIQ Christians as prophetically vital agents of destiny in not only preparing Christians for the Second Coming of Christ, but also ushering in the First Coming of the Messiah that the Jews will recognize, thus fulfilling Isaiah 56:8, Isaiah 61:4-11, and Romans 11:25. Discover Scriptures that reveal Jesus will return to the earth as a Jew living under the New Covenant, in order to have authority to rule both Jew and Gentile. Also explores how this realization explains why Adolph Hitler targeted both LGBTQIQ people and Jews during the Holocaust, and demonstrates that it was much more than mere coincidence.

__________________________________

THANK YOU for your generous support of this work!

Let him who receives instruction in the Word of God share all good things with his teacher, contributing to his support.  Galatians 6:6

Tap to Donate

10% of all donations received by this ministry are tithed to my personal Home Church.

The remaining 90% are used exclusively to purchase necessary equipment, to cover fees related to funding our ministry website, to produce, advertise, publish, and distribute teaching media, books, and videos, and to fund regular operational costs incurred in the process of reaching out to Churches and Pastors to share these teachings with their Congregations.

We couldn't do it without YOU!

__________________________________